Ron Paul is wrong on Waco
THIS IS NOT A REPOST THE FIRST ONE WAS A MISTAKE(I HIT ENTER) AND THE SECOND ONE YOU LABELED REPOST, PLEASE DONT REJECT
SS_cat confronted me when I disputed knowitall paul and then blocked me so eat this.
"The stated purpose of the raid was suspected federal firearms violation, nothing in the warrant about children. The warrant was pretty flimsy."
Partially wrong, I never said the wa
More..rrant was issued because of the children I said it is what initially caught their attention. "But there was more, too, which came out in the days ahead. Linedecker claims that the local newspaper was running a series of articles about Koresh's dubious activities, entitled "The Sinful Messiah," based on accounts by defectors like Marc Breault, who later authored Inside the Cult. Breault had hired detectives to snoop around and when contacted by the ATF, he supplied a number of detailed descriptions of his former associates. He denounced Koresh, speaking of child abuse and polygamy." Calling the warrant flimsy is well, true. But it is on the grounds of hostile witnesses and people who testify against someone else are usually hostile. The warrant was presented to koresh and he slammed the door in their face wether it is bullshit or not you have to abide to a law enforcement officer with a warrant. "Koresh looked out from behind a steel door and learned that the agents had a search warrant. Instead of letting them in, he slammed the door and then someone started shooting. It's not clear from which side the first bullets came, but both sides commenced a fierce gun battle. Wessinger says that survivors of the skirmish and the subsequent standoff claimed that bullets came in through the ceiling, which meant that agents in the helicopters were firing into the compound. The ATF, in several hearings afterward, say no one in the choppers fired a single shot. By some reports, agents were shooting the dogs to get them out of the way and that's what started the deadly crossfire between the two groups. Women from inside who survived claimed they'd placed their bodies over the children to protect them from the rain of bullets."
http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/not_guilty/koresh/1.html
"Reports from Joyce Sparks, an investigator from the Texas agency responsible for protective services, stated that she had found no evidence that the allegations were true in any of several visits to the Mount Carmel site over a period of months, but said that she was not permitted to speak with the children alone, nor was she permitted to inspect all areas of the site. She noted that safety concerns over construction sites at Mount Carmel were immediately addressed and corrected."
True but not true- "One glaring oversight became evident when Joyce Sparks, a social worker with the Texas Department of Child Protective Services, appeared before the panel on July 21st. In 1992, Sparks had been involved in checking out rumors of child abuse at Mr. Carmel (no signs of abuse were found, and the case was closed due to lack of evidence). One of her visits, on April 6, 1992, was mentioned in the "probable cause" affidavit signed by ATF Agent Davy Aguilera, which served as the basis for the warrant to search the complex. Aguilera stated that Sparks "said that during her conversation with Koresh [on April 6th], he told her that he was the 'messenger' from God, that the world was coming to an end, and that when he 'reveals' himself the riots in Los Angeles would pale in comparison to what was going to happen in Waco, Texas. Koresh stated that it would be a 'military-type operation' and that all the 'non-believers' would have to suffer"
David liked to beat the kids where they wouldnt look, a social worker is not going to pull a childs pants down.....
"With the sect consumed by fire, the tales of life in Mount Carmel come mostly out of the mouths of babes. As stories from survivors, former Davidians and a psychiatric report on the children confirmed last week, the Ranch Apocalypse experience was one of deprivation and fear. Denied traditional family bonds and exposed to Koresh's warped teachings, the children became compliant playthings, expected to live by every word issuing from the mad messiah of Waco.
When young Davidians strayed from his commands, their punishment was severe (though one survivor insisted such redress was basic ''Christian discipline''). Disobedience frequently brought out the ''helper,'' a paddle often wielded by Koresh's ''mighty men'' in the ''whipping room'' just off the first floor. The instrument left circle-shaped lesions, an inch across, on the children's buttocks. Koresh's son Cyrus, when he was three years old, once refused a command and, according to a former cult member, was starved for two days and forced to sleep on a garage floor where Koresh told him large rats prowled."
http://www.time.com/time/daily/newsfiles/waco/051793.html
"Posse Comitatus Act. Martial law must be declared. So Ron Paul seems to be right again."
WRONG- "There are a number of situations in which the Act does not apply. These include:
National Guard units while under the authority of the governor of a state;
Troops when used pursuant to the Federal authority to quell domestic violence as was the case during the 1992 Los Angeles riots;
Troops used under the order of the President of the United States pursuant to the Insurrection Act
Under 18 U.S.C. § 831, the Attorney General(JANET RENO) may request that the Secretary of Defense provide emergency assistance if civilian law enforcement is inadequate to address certain types of threat involving the release of nuclear materials, such as potential use of a Nuclear or Radiological weapon. Such assistance may be by any personnel under the authority of the Department of Defense, provided such assistance does not adversely affect U.S. military preparedness"
ONCE AGAIN UNTIL KATRINA ACTIVE DUTY TROOPS CANNOT BE USED AGAINST A CIVILIAN POPULATIONS NATIONAL GUARDSMEN ARE FEDRALIZED.
"How is "they wanted to talk to the media" a lie.... I see no lie in this statement. The people thought that the feds were going to kill them all (looks like they were right) and they wanted to talk to someone in the outside world who would listen to them and get their words out. Maybe their side of the story. Also, the media HAS been allowed to talk to people in a standoff with the police before."
Okay yes it has been done and why dont you tell us how that turned out and why they stopped doing it?
"No they didn't, you obviously don't understand the constitution and bill of rights to say that. They were designed for the purpose protecting people from that sort of thing. Being persecuted without proof. Ron Paul is right. There are alot of shady things that went down around that event, but I am not going to talk about them anymore now"
No you dont understand the constitution, you are allowed to have a "well regulated" militia, THE GOVERMENT HAS EVERY RIGHT TO QUESTION THEM FOR THE PROTECTION OF OTHER CITIZENS FROM AN OBVIOUS WELL DOCUMENTED SOCIOPATH LOOK AT HIS HISTORY. All he had to do was provide the proof and that would of been the end of it.
"Did the article say that CS gas was never used on you. I had CS gas used on me plenty too (and it is retarded. I learned nothing from it except that cs gas isn't fun. They could have just said that). CS gas is banned under the Paris Convention on Chemical Warfare. So I guess it wasn't a lie after all, huh. "
There is no such thing as the convention on chemical warfare, there is the CWC or chemical weapons convention that took place in paris and it has NOTHING to do with CS gas, and I sure as hell cant find one single thing on CS being banned for law enforcement use ANYWHERE. Please show me where you saw this.
From OPCW.org "Riot control agents (RCAs) such as CS were the topic of long and heated debates during the CWC negotiations. At issue were their inclusion in the treaty and the restrictions that would be imposed upon their use. In the end, a compromise was reached under which States Parties are to declare to the OPCW the RCAs they possess for law enforcement purposes. Though use is allowed for these purposes, it is prohibited as a method of warfare"
Calling me brainwashed and then blocking me for calling you an asshole is pathetic. Less..
Added: May 20 2007 In: news_politics
By: 0311 
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